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chihawk
Clan Blood Spirit
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 Posted: 06-Jul-2002 15:49 Post subject: Spider Man Meets MWDA |
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Most folks are totally indifferent about it, only the most vocal seem to be angry about it.
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Karagin
Imperial Karagin Army
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| Posted: 06-Jul-2002 15:56 Post subject: Spider Man Meets MWDA |
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You need to check out Sarna and re-read most of the post on Rick's site...plus HPG is up in arms about MWDA...so the idea that current players like the new game and will be actively playing it from day one is nuts...some might but not all.
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Karagin
Only the dead have seen the end of war. - Plato
"Wasted trip Man. Nobody said nuthin' about lockin' horns with no tigers." Oddball
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chihawk
Clan Blood Spirit
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| Posted: 06-Jul-2002 16:02 Post subject: Spider Man Meets MWDA |
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Didn't say that they would be playing it, all I said was that they aren't angry about it. 
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Warner
Clan Nova Cat
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Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
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| Posted: 07-Jul-2002 08:39 Post subject: Spider Man Meets MWDA |
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On 2002-07-06 15:56, Karagin wrote:
You need to check out Sarna and re-read most of the post on Rick's site...plus HPG is up in arms about MWDA...so the idea that current players like the new game and will be actively playing it from day one is nuts...some might but not all.
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So let me get this straight.. what you are saying is that these folks represent the majority of the all BattleTech Players and therefore speak for them all as their representatives?
Can you give me conclusive scientific results of a Zogby Poll type research to prove this? If so I will take that information up to what you call The Powers To Be and show them so they can do what needs to be done. Please don't point me to a message board with a few hundred members and a thread that has 35 of the same people posting on it because that is not scientific. You have made a statement claiming these things now I am asking you back them up Karagin. Show me the factual proof. Thank you.
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Warner Doles
Site Administrator
CBT Development Team Member
ClassicBattleTech.com
admin@classicbattletech.com
[ This Message was edited by: Warner on 2002-07-07 08:40 ]
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As always, enjoy!
Warner Doles
"Who am I? I am the right hand of fiat, tormentor of souls, death incarnate, and the last living writer you will ever see. Randall sent me."
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Karagin
Imperial Karagin Army
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Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 4120
Location: United States
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| Posted: 07-Jul-2002 09:53 Post subject: Spider Man Meets MWDA |
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Once again Warner, you are taking things personally. What I was pointing out was NOT all of the players of BT are happy with the current direction of the universe and game.
And this is not helped with amount of rumors and lack of OFFICAL word on the state of BT and it's contintuation as we know it know after the release of MWDA.
What I am also saying is based on the posted responces of the fans on several messages boards, including the CBT boards, a large majority are against the new the game in one way or another.
Nothing I said was scientific, it was me expressing an opinion. Again I point out that every time someone voices an opinion that is not favorable of MWDA one of the folks who is in the know come down on them like a ton of bricks. Why is this?
Why can't folks NOT like the click based version of the game? Why does it matter if they like it or not?
Personally I think it's big step backwards and will end up catering to kids ages 6-12. While that might bring in, and please note this a wild ass guess, less then 2% of them into BT going with the idea that they find out about BT beyond MWDA. That leaves the other 98% finding other things to do with their time and leaving the game once the coolness (or what ever the new slang is for that word) wears off.
For example, tons of folks played Magic, but I don't see as many stores carrying the product as they when it was the hottest thing since word came out that they were making the first three Star Wars movies. In fact in the Western Michigan area you actually have to go to a comic book store or a hobby shop to get the cards, where as before you could go to Miejer's (local supermarket/department store) and buy them cheaper then at a Hobby or Comic store. Magic had it's day in the sun and slowly died off...but look at all the other card games that tried to compete and failed to reach Magic's level. That is what has a lot of folks worried about with MWDA.
They see it competing against Warhammer and losing. They see it competing against Battletech and they don't like it.
On top of that a lot of the folks feel that Jordan and the rest have forgotten about the die hard BTechers and are more worried about making money at the expense of the loyal long term, been here forever, fans. And that ticks a lot of them off.
IF you want a scientific poll or something like that, then I suggest you find away to set up something that allows ONE vote on the issue of MWDA Yay or Nay, without any replies beyond that and then go from there.
What needs to stop though is this idea that if someone expresses their dislike of MWDA they get yelled at to put it nicely because they expressed that opinion.
The areas most of the folks who have expressed an opinion via the net are:
The timeline/history of thing beyond the end of the FC Civil War.
The Click Bases on the Mechs, new rule system makes the current miniatures obsolete.
Change in scale of the mechs etc...
The collectible issue of buying sight unseen of the mechs etc...
Those issues come up time and again and no matter what is said on either side no one will listen to the other. And the converstions fall down into to level of flame wars or worse.
So both side need to lighten up and those with the information need to stop using it as a club to beat the other side into the ground and the other side needs to stop doing the same as well.
Everyone has their opinion on the game as it stands currently and on the way it's going. I have heard folks talk about ignoring the whole Clicky issue and using the new timeline as background material and playing as normal. Others have sold their collections and said to hell with a childish neutering of BT. Others have no plans to play MWDA OR use anything from it in their games. While some plan on giving it a chance and then if they don't like it or can't find players have said they will go back to BT only. Others plan on playing nothing but MWDA to keep current.
No one is right or wrong on this, what is important is the idea that we all are having fun and to some that has been lost with all the changes they see happening.
I hope this helps you out. If not, well all I can say about it then is I hope that Jordan is listening to the fans and can see what we see...
Take care,
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Karagin
Only the dead have seen the end of war. - Plato
"Wasted trip Man. Nobody said nuthin' about lockin' horns with no tigers." Oddball
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chihawk
Clan Blood Spirit
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Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
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| Posted: 07-Jul-2002 10:40 Post subject: Spider Man Meets MWDA |
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I disagree with the following statement:
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What I am also saying is based on the posted responces of the fans on several messages boards, including the CBT boards, a large majority are against the new the game in one way or another.
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Based on what I've read (and many of us frequent many of the same boards) there is a very vocal minority that is against MW:DA. The vast majority of posters are in the "middle of the road" and are waiting to see how this all turns out.
Now I can see many people's replies already: read the boards and you'll see very few people saying anything positive about MW:DA. And they'd be correct, but not for the reasons many would think.
How can someone say anything positive about something that doesn't actually exist yet? And why would anyone say anything positive about a game knowing they will get flamed for it because they are "spewing the company line"?
Now the place where people may have a legitimate gripe is about the timeline. But as we've been told this was the general timeline FASA had in mind anyway, so trying to pin that on WizKids fails the logic test.
What I don't understand is the hatred that some have for MW:DA. Why does anyone care?
MW:DA IS NOT BATTLETECH!!!!!!!!!!
If anyone dislikes where Battletech is going they can always ignore the timeline in their campaigns (Hell, I started doing that when the Clans showed up  ) and add the new tech as they see fit.
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Warner
Clan Nova Cat
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Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
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| Posted: 07-Jul-2002 11:18 Post subject: Spider Man Meets MWDA |
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On 2002-07-07 09:53, Karagin wrote:
Once again Warner, you are taking things personally. What I was pointing out was NOT all of the players of BT are happy with the current direction of the universe and game.
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Three things.
1.) If I were taking something personal I would have replied to Cadet's insult about the "idiots running the company." I am not taking anything personal. I asked you a fair question to back up your factual statement that you made which was not stated as an opinion. Until you can prove your case you are making allot of noise because you and a few of the fans who claim to be the majority in actuality are a very small minority compared to the total of the fans, that are unhappy.
As to the rest of what you said… it’s the same rehashed argument that you’ve been stating from the beginning. I tried to tell you on the phone but you have completely ignored what I said. But hey that is your choice. I won’t make that mistake again.
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I hope this helps you out. If not, well all I can say about it then is I hope that Jordan is listening to the fans and can see what we see...
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2.) Remember what Lance Hawkins said to you on Sarna about "in reference to" Bryan Nystul and those in the development team and what Bryan said as he quit? Guess what? He was absolutely correct. The analogy of "The boy that cried wolf" applies here.
3.) You want to be heard? You had better find a better way to state your opinion instead of the demeaning hateful way you sling your opinions across those message boards that do not get frequented by The Powers To Be. Because until you and your ‘majority’ do Erich then, the source(s) are considered, duly noted and immediately dismissed.
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As always, enjoy!
Warner Doles
"Who am I? I am the right hand of fiat, tormentor of souls, death incarnate, and the last living writer you will ever see. Randall sent me."
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Stinger
The Knights of Chaos
General
Joined: 30-Apr-2002 00:00
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| Posted: 07-Jul-2002 11:56 Post subject: Spider Man Meets MWDA |
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Well from what I understand Warner you have acess to the "Powers that be" (I may be wrong but some of the references if seen seem to say that), Have them start the poll on their home page or on the MWDA site.
As for myself and my friends, we think its GARBAGE! What they have done to the universe is a PURE SHAME! and I know that WE (their are 15 to 20 of us that play and prefer Battletech to all other RPG's) will not waste our time and money on what they are trying to sell us (or will be since its not out yet).
Your asking Karagin to provide a poll result. Well if you have access to the "Powers that be" IM ASKING you to set up that poll through them and well see. Set up a link on all of the major board to the site and code it to allow you to only vote once or something, then they can see where the public stands.
Now Understand that Im not trying to start a fight or a flame war, Ive no time for it. But I do love the Battletech universe and am disgusted by what they did, I would rather fix it then see it die and I think that what they have done is to effectevily kill the game. They took one of my favorite past times and ruined it. And that is what bothers me more than anything else, that and there inability to see that and go for profit only.
Stinger
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Stinger
If it's "creepy" to use the Internet, military satellites, and robot aircraft to find a house full of gorgeous young models so I can drop in on them unexpected, then FINE, I'm "creepy". Howard Wolowitz. BBT.
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Karagin
Imperial Karagin Army
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Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
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Location: United States
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| Posted: 07-Jul-2002 12:26 Post subject: Spider Man Meets MWDA |
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On 2002-07-07 11:18, Warner wrote:
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On 2002-07-07 09:53, Karagin wrote:
Once again Warner, you are taking things personally. What I was pointing out was NOT all of the players of BT are happy with the current direction of the universe and game.
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Three things.
1.) If I were taking something personal I would have replied to Cadet's insult about the "idiots running the company." I am not taking anything personal. I asked you a fair question to back up your factual statement that you made which was not stated as an opinion. Until you can prove your case you are making allot of noise because you and a few of the fans who claim to be the majority in actuality are a very small minority compared to the total of the fans, that are unhappy.
As to the rest of what you said… it’s the same rehashed argument that you’ve been stating from the beginning. I tried to tell you on the phone but you have completely ignored what I said. But hey that is your choice. I won’t make that mistake again.
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I hope this helps you out. If not, well all I can say about it then is I hope that Jordan is listening to the fans and can see what we see...
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2.) Remember what Lance Hawkins said to you on Sarna about "in reference to" Bryan Nystul and those in the development team and what Bryan said as he quit? Guess what? He was absolutely correct. The analogy of "The boy that cried wolf" applies here.
3.) You want to be heard? You had better find a better way to state your opinion instead of the demeaning hateful way you sling your opinions across those message boards that do not get frequented by The Powers To Be. Because until you and your ‘majority’ do Erich then, the source(s) are considered, duly noted and immediately dismissed.
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Warner this a clear sign that you are taking it personally. IF you are not then why even comment?
My opinion of Bryan is just that an opinion, if some one doesn't like it, fine I am glad to know that my opinions are not everyone's.
SO we are making a lot of noise. Again I point that by saying that you are inferring that Jordan and company are not going to listen to us unless we give a poll or petitation that has every fan's signature on it demanding that he stop with MWDA...nice to see he can do that based on your comment.
A few of the fans...right okay if you say so. I have read BOTH sides of the fight, and so far it seems to be about even on who is against MWDA and who is for it. Then there is the wait and see group and then as I said the ones who have said the hell with it and left altogether. What I do see if folks who are strong supports of the game bashing MWDA. I know you have seen the same postings since you visit most of the same boards as I do.
Again, how can one get a factual poll or otherwise that someone on the side that is fully supporting MWDA isn't going to say is a load of rubbish? Again I point out that with your responce you are saying in a round about way that no one can have negative opinion of MWDA without facts to back up their dislikes. Funny last time I looked dislikes were OPINIONS based off of how one felt after reading or watching something et...are you saying we can't have those based on what has been put out via WK's MWDA webpage info and such?
By the way it's spelled E-R-I-C =ERIC, no "h" in there.
I am glad to see that those who speak up about the game are dismissed just because a handful of the friends of TPTB don't like them...that statment really shows someone's true colors.
Who's crying wolf? Not me. Maybe it is you and the others who steadfastly defend everything that is done in BT as perfect no matter how many folks comment on out crazy or silly it is. Bryan's quiting was his descisson. He was the Line Devoloper, he signed off on the projects and had control over things. Thus he was going to catch the flak when the fans found errors or tried to express ideas on how they (we) felt things could be done better etc...this hobby is customer driven, and like any customer driven industry if you tick them off you will hear about it. The idea is though to take the feedback and work with it, both the good and the bad, and not just look at the good. For example, every month I get evauluated as an NCO by my platoon seregant. He lists out where he thinks and feels I have done well in and where I need to improve etc...I have yet to see an NCOER with nothing but You are excllent don't change, you rock etc...on it. No one is perfect. Thus the need to take the good with the bad.
It seems to me that there is a small but vocale group that willl defend TPTB no matter what in this game. That is great, but I think it's getting out of hand, and become a problem.
So you support MWDA, fine, again you are not looking at the other side here. I listed why folks are upset, and I gathered that based off what has been the most repeated points out there. But I missed one. The newest and biggest complaint is the releasing of MWDA history notes that fall back to the current time line of BT. A good number of the folks are upset that now instead of wondering and speculating as to what is going to happen, we already know what is going to happen with major events upto the MWDA story line start point. Did you think that would go over well with the fans at all?
Let me ask you this can you prove factually that more fans are FULLY 100% happy with MWDA and it's changes then those who are not?
By this I mean a majority who are so happy that the game has changed to colletiable minatures game, with clik base counters and a vast jump in the timeline etc...can you do this? Oh since you pointed out that certain folks get dimissed because of who they are, anyone working for FP, WK and the CBT message board don't count. This here to make it fair and unbais.
I would like to see this since it may help me do the same and then maybe we can all see where folks stand.
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Karagin
Only the dead have seen the end of war. - Plato
"Wasted trip Man. Nobody said nuthin' about lockin' horns with no tigers." Oddball
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Cadet
ComStar
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Joined: 17-Mar-2002 00:00
Posts: 495
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| Posted: 07-Jul-2002 12:51 Post subject: Spider Man Meets MWDA |
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Quote:
| You want to be heard? You had better find a better way to state your opinion instead of the demeaning hateful way you sling your opinions across those message boards that do not get frequented by The Powers To Be. Because until you and your ‘majority’ do Erich then, the source(s) are considered, duly noted and immediately dismissed. |
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Well since the Powers That Be don't read those message boards, what does it matter what we say or how we say it on them?
I think it smacks of arrogance that they wouldn't ever look at what their fan base is saying, except for on the Official site. Their business is fan driven and not everyone posts on the Official site.
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Warner
Clan Nova Cat
Oathmaster
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 175
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| Posted: 07-Jul-2002 13:14 Post subject: Spider Man Meets MWDA |
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On 2002-07-07 11:56, Stinger wrote:
Well from what I understand Warner you have access to the "Powers that be" (I may be wrong but some of the references if seen seem to say that), Have them start the poll on their home page or on the MWDA site.
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For what? To hear from a few hundred people who are going to react in the same manner you are? What good is that going to do? It’s not going to change anything at all. The new storyline is going to happen and those that have been screaming the hateful diatribes about the game and those people’s character running it aren’t going to be heard. That’s the cold hard facts of it. All the ugliness that has been fired off in the last year has done more harm and no one is going to listen to it anymore.
As to be “close to the powers to be”, that may be true but I am not going to tell them anything that they already know from the vast amount of hate and death mail they’ve gotten over the last year. And frankly I wouldn’t even dream of it. I love what is going to happen. You or anyone else want to claim it to be dead and worthless you go right ahead. But you are wrong. And that IS all I am going to say. Just do me a favor, don’t bash those that want to enjoy the new timeline. Everyone has their own thing and they should be respected to do and enjoy what they want regardless of when and where it is.
Classic BattleTech is still the same and more is happening with it now then it has in the last few years. We’ve done more for the fans in the last 6 months then FASA did during its time and we are planning more (Karagin don’t bother with the House Books or the Unseen original pictures as it is never going to be revisited again). Yet all people want to focus on is the new game and claim it is the replacement for Classic BattleTech (which it is not) or that the direction of the game is crap because those that are doing this have no idea of what they are doing and they have no creativity to make it happen. I love how this is stated when only a brief flash of what is happening is automatically decried and treated like crap. And those in charge are idiots and don’t have any idea of what they are doing. Hey can you imagine what would have happened if they had just let it BattleTech just die and then been done with it. I wonder what people would be saying about it now.
MechWarrior Darkages the game is NOT replacing Classic BattleTech nor was it ever meant to. But those that want speak like they are the ultimate authorities on the game and the business are making such asinine claims that they are. And they want to see MechWarrior Darkages die and fail. All because they HATE the direction of the game is going, then new collectable miniatures game and believe those things they are saying. Did ever occur to you and anyone else if that was to happen, the game you claim to love so much DIES with it? You don't think they are going to keep a game around that has a fan base so small it can't support itself with?
This is a game. It is not real life. And the response I have seen from supposedly grown men on this subject sure embarrasses me to no end. The things said about people. The lies spread about people and the down right hateful and ugly vile treatment for those doing the best they can for the game has been disgusting to say the least. Had I been a weak willed person, I would have quit doing what I am doing and deleted everything from my website and hard drive and walked away for the amount of crap that was fired at me. All because people have their opinions. Having opinions on this is fine. I have never once said anything against anyone have an opinion one way or the other. The only thing I have ever said about peoples opinions was, ‘…either wait and see for all the information before you arbitrarily make your decision to hate the game.’ Or ‘Your opinion doesn’t give you the right to treat people in the most vile and ugly manners I have seen.’ And that includes Mordel’s, Sarna, Patrick’s, Lord’s of the Battlefield, Solaris 7 and RGM just to mention a few. Did it ever occur to you why those Powers to Be never post there anymore or just plain out avoid them?
If you don't like the direction the game goes, do your own thing in it. This universe that has been constructed by those Powers to be that everyone who claims to be the majority is cursing, have developed a dynamic universe to play in with or without the current timeline.
So as to your question: Why don't I set up a poll? No. Why? Because it doesn't matter what a poll is going to say. Why? Because they are going to do what they want in the universe and I for one am looking forward to it. Just like I am looking forward to playing MechWarrior Darkagethe game too. And I will continue to play Classic BattleTech the game too. Why? I am not one to do what you and the others are doing because they are not willing to be sensible about this. As I see it, it doesn't matter any more because you in your own mind, you and the rest have already made up your minds. And that is my final word on this as I know where this conversation may end up going and very unkind things will be said about me because I support the game and company. I don't believe there is anything else I can say other then I am sorry that people cannot be sensible and reasonable about this at all.
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As always, enjoy!
Warner Doles
"Who am I? I am the right hand of fiat, tormentor of souls, death incarnate, and the last living writer you will ever see. Randall sent me."
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Warner
Clan Nova Cat
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Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
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| Posted: 07-Jul-2002 13:38 Post subject: Spider Man Meets MWDA |
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Well since the Powers That Be don't read those message boards, what does it matter what we say or how we say it on them?
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Why? Because when they come to a message board like this and read the kind of things you said about them or others have, they get sick and tired of it and walk away from the fans and don't want to interact with them because of those things that have been said. That's why. Can you blame them? I cannot and will not.
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Really? How about this? They go where they know they are welcome and will be treated fairly and not like heretics and have their characters questioned, intelligence questions, families threatened, themselves threatened or any other thing that I have seen at times here, Sarna and the other message boards that they will not bother with again. You want to call it arrogance? But you are wrong. Call it for what it is. The mistreatment by many here and those elsewhere for the sake of voicing their opinions no matter whom they hurt has caused many sleepless nights for some. And for one, to quit and walk away from something that he loved deeply all because of the treatment he got by the so-called "fans."
And why do I still come here or on Sarna? I thought because I was still part of the fan base. But I see that I am not. I am now part of those "idiots running the company" you stated. Since I am writing and helping produce the game now I was trying to stay in the background and keep abreast of things. But now I see that I cannot do that anymore because I am sickened by what I read and I've not been the recipient of the hate...yet. At least here I thought I could stay around and try to participate but they amount of ugliness I am seeing here is starting to equal Sarna and LotB. All for the sake of voicing they almighty opinion no matter who gets hurt. That’s why they don’t want to bother with any of the boards outside of ClassicBattleTech.Com’s Message Board. And not that it matters anymore, but a very select few of us (that have been viciously attacked by Karagin as ‘Gods of BattleTech’ and other unkind things) have been the eyes and ears for them and I guess we won’t be doing that anymore either. Not that it matters anymore.
Look I’ve taken nothing personal here from you or anyone else. But I think it is time for me to move on and not bother here or the other boards anymore because of all that is being said and I am not allowed to step in and say anything. I know I will catch the devil for my three posts here but I had to say something. Whether it was right or wrong is immaterial at this point. I said what was on my heart and tried to do so in a manner to show everyone that you can indeed have an opinion and state it without attacking someone and calling them vile names or calling into question their intelligence or family linage. Chihawk or Mordel if you want to delete my login I’ll understand as I do not I believe I’ll be back to post or participate anymore unless people are treated equally and fairly here, not for the sake of being heard and voicing an opinion.
_________________
As always, enjoy!
Warner Doles
"Who am I? I am the right hand of fiat, tormentor of souls, death incarnate, and the last living writer you will ever see. Randall sent me."
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Karagin
Imperial Karagin Army
Imperial General
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 4120
Location: United States
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| Posted: 07-Jul-2002 17:20 Post subject: Spider Man Meets MWDA |
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Warner I will bother with those (House Books and Unseen pictures)if I want to and I will support other folks efforts in those areas.
I am sorry if you don't like that but that is your opinion.
Now can we get back to talk about the so-called Spider and enought with flames and ego bashing....
Thanks.
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Karagin
Only the dead have seen the end of war. - Plato
"Wasted trip Man. Nobody said nuthin' about lockin' horns with no tigers." Oddball
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chihawk
Clan Blood Spirit
Master Bartender
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 8075
Location: United States
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| Posted: 07-Jul-2002 19:27 Post subject: Spider Man Meets MWDA |
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To be honest karagin, you got what you were shooting for, which was Warner blasting you.
I'm saying the following in public so there's no question...
Do not post again until you hear from Mordel. This is the end of your participation in this discussion.
_________________
"You all laugh at me because I'm different; I laugh at you because you're all the same" Anon
[ This Message was edited by: chihawk on 2002-07-07 19:28 ]
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Stinger
The Knights of Chaos
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Location: United States
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| Posted: 07-Jul-2002 22:07 Post subject: Spider Man Meets MWDA |
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Warner I fully understand its a game, I always have and I always will.
Now for the but.
But, what they have done to my favorite hobby, by, NOT continuing from where it left off, is to in my opinion abandon me and my friends, and that is what bothers me. They took something that in popularity was second only to either Warhammer or D&D and completely changed it, when they DID NOT have to to be sucessful.
The reason they are getting blasted is because what they have done in all honesty....
DOSENT MAKE ANY SENCE AT ALL.
There was no reason to completely change everything, and that, is the big reason for the bashing they are taking by the hard core fans, the ones that didn't want to see a change. It, in my opinion, as Chihawk has said is NOT Battletech, but it does impact it. And the fans that didn't want a change know this. What companies have to realize is that by taking a sucessful line that has been around for what, 15-16 years, they didnt need to change it to be sucessful,and by altering it to a new product, they could have started it seperately for the younger generation and continued the "Classic Battletech" unchanged. If they had done that I might be interested in trying it out, but they didnt they said that this is what were doing and if you dont like it to bad adapt. This was the basic response I got when I sent them e-mails back when they announced it at the beginning.
Now again I understand its a game, but being in my late 20's, it's one of my few escapes I have, and seeing it changed is, in many ways disapointing.
Will I get over it?
Yes, Ive already done that
Do I have other hobby that I presue?
Yup. But B-tech was my favorite.
Am I happy about it?
Well they didnt give me much choice, did they?
Will I support what they have done?
No, I've seen what they are now trying to pass off as "Mechs", and I just don't like it. I want to build and paint them not just buy and play.
Have I ever seen anyone playing Mage Knight?
Nope, never seen my favorite hobby shop carry any of the products, and I live in washington.
Did I want to get on anyones "bad side"?
No Im honestely just stating a opinion, does it mean anything. No. Do you have to agree with it? NOT at ALL I do hope you read this with an open mind. Its nothing more than a statement from a CBT fan.
Do I understand why your glad why they did what they did? Sorry No. there was nothing wrong with it. Am I going to blast you? No not intentinally, And if I have, or you feel I have, please accept my apology and lets move on with life. 
Stinger
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Stinger
If it's "creepy" to use the Internet, military satellites, and robot aircraft to find a house full of gorgeous young models so I can drop in on them unexpected, then FINE, I'm "creepy". Howard Wolowitz. BBT.
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